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Rowpunk
#149160407Tuesday, November 04, 2014 7:52 AM GMT

This post is assuming that you are an experienced game developer with the interest of creating an forerunner expanded tycoon that can set a new standard for this (mostly) dead genre with an innate replay value (aka, continued visits) attached. The current tycoon system is very simple to understand from a developer point of view. By limiting the flow of content, the player's curiosity is perked enough to stay simply to find out what comes next. It's a system that makes the player feel good about unlocking the next item, enough to persuade them to spend two to three hours watching their territory grow slowly. The main reason that this genre received a negative stigma in ROBLOX was that developers failed to recognize the strength of a tycoon and tried to spread out low quality content over a longer period of time in the hopes that players would stay for longer. Truthfully, the core system of the tycoon is far from dead. While the genre slowed down here on ROBLOX: java, flash, unity, and mobile "Incremental Games", or "Idle Games" have continued to gain popularity within the browser game community. Notably, Cookie Clicker was averaging 200,000 players per day in 2013, and more recently AdVenture Capitalist has 16 million plays as of writing this post. So what's different? Incremental Games and Tycoons follow the same general formula, both push the user towards the next upgrades. The longer you play the game the bigger your numbers get and generally the user feels like they are making progress. The primary difference is the consideration for replay ability that Incremental Games hold. Their core purpose is to have you leave with a sense that you aren't finished yet. Contrarily, tycoons here are generally single-use games, with the content being very limited and little incentive to continue playing after completion. There is a very specific reason why our tycoons evolved such, but as it isn't relevant I won't go into the details. If you decide that you're interested in making a game that consistently hold players past the limitations of your content, then following this path may be for you. When placing down your framework keep in mind a few specific things that will help you out. One, you need to have a prestige system. Some call it soft resets, others give a unique name to them. The important part is that they let the user play through the game again with a set of bonuses. These bonuses vary from game to game, Anti-Idle by Tukkun had points to place into a skill tree of very strong bonuses. Other games have a money/xp multiplier that increases the further you make it before resetting. Two, items shouldn't have a maximum that the player can reach, instead experiment with different formulas for the item costs. This is a very basic case study, and I suggest that you take a look at some of these games (possibly play them for a short period of time, that's part of being a developer mind you!) and synthesis your own original ideas. A half [REDACTED] attempt at making the game will end up being a flop and you will have simply wasted your time. Here are a few different genres that I consider good examples, make sure to note how smoothly they incorporate monetization. AdVenture Capitalist, unity (HyperHippoGames) -- example of soft resets, upgrades, and achievements (i didn't mention those, oh well, they're important). Dirt Inc., iPhone/Android. (Digital Panda Studios) -- Example of how physical objects (bricks) could be incorporated into the game without generating a lot of lag Battle Without End, flash (CritGame) -- one of the best more RPG styled idle games A Dark Room, website (Michael Townsend) -- no reset, perfect example of perking interest from the player by revealing the contently slowly. Idle Mine, flash (Crovie) --no reset, but continues for a very long time (think 4 years of playing) Let me know if you have any questions/comments/concerns and I'll eventually get to them. Happy Building!
Rowpunk
#149200201Wednesday, November 05, 2014 12:58 AM GMT

One hour of writing for 6 views. #worth
morash
#149202513Wednesday, November 05, 2014 1:28 AM GMT

ROBLOX developers really blew the tycoon concept out of proportion as it is. The most accurate tycoon style game I've seen would be Pool Tycoon 3 and 4.
Rowpunk
#149205081Wednesday, November 05, 2014 2:02 AM GMT

Now you're talking about a different genre entirely. When I think of a tycoon that follows that style I generally think of running a virtual business. Tycoons and Incremental Games have different playstyles and goals, and I believe that roblox tycoons never actually fit inside the tycoon genre, but were honestly pretty early concepts of idle games.
Visleaf
#149226624Wednesday, November 05, 2014 4:11 PM GMT

Idle games are in a way an evolution of gambling type games such as coin pusher or stacker (self-promotion whoo~). Someone actually made a thread about his coin pusher remake on this subforum a while back. Do keep in mind that the more you can hide the idle game behind the gameplay mechanics, the more players will think they like the game. COD kinda does this; the entire XP, level and unlock system is basically just a well-disguised idle game requiring next to no meaningful thought or interaction. Combining idle games with incremental games is a good idea. The concept of an idle game should in my opinion be used to enhance existing genres by tricking players into thinking the game they see is fun instead of the game they're playing. As long as the content for the game they think they like doesn't run out, they won't stop playing it unless they see through the trickery (players are kinda smart sometimes). Examples include but are not limited to: - GunBros (2) - COD:Recent-ish Installments 3 MP - Grindy RPG games in general - Dungeon Keeper Mobile - Animal Crossing? Another important note; there's often no way to end the game in a worse condition. Players always win a little just by playing. To make this obvious to the player's brain, just explicitly award him with anything just for playing. He might not notice this though.
Rowpunk
#149282180Thursday, November 06, 2014 7:09 PM GMT

Bumpity bump bump. You make some awesome points that I didn't even consider when writing this at 2 am.
Rowpunk
#149921531Monday, November 17, 2014 2:05 AM GMT

Ze bumps, they call to me!
Rowpunk
#149983182Tuesday, November 18, 2014 2:34 AM GMT

Well I think i'll stop bumping this in a few days since it isn't gaining much traction.
Plutonem
#149985062Tuesday, November 18, 2014 3:02 AM GMT

Actually, I already knew about that but really useful for somebody that isn't an 'experienced game developer' at the moment.
Rowpunk
#151608357Saturday, December 13, 2014 4:58 PM GMT

*cough* and now extra credits has made a video about it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-LziX2HynI
richaell
#179003511Wednesday, December 02, 2015 2:49 PM GMT

Most useful post I've seen in a long time. In a sense, not getting much traction makes sense, otherwise, this whole idea wouldn't be valid. I'm no developer, but completely understand most concepts of it. Imagine a roblox following these bases. What it wonderful world it would be.
ForeverNotts
#179004725Wednesday, December 02, 2015 3:56 PM GMT

It is a strange point you have made here. Yes people do play games on the side nearly, but that is the same having music, or a film on whilst doing work of some sort. I know it works for people, but I am not sure why you have tried to link this to roblox tycoons. Roblox tycoons have such a diversity, I do question what possible use is there starting this thread. Some tycoons are the simple button progression, some are with obbies to boost progess. There is also the work/find a job style that many games have adopted. We also have games like Pool Tycoon 3/4, and miners haven, that are more open and customizable. We even have had games that are just hire more staff/upgrade equipment. With all them styles of tycoons, I wonder how you are expanding the genre by these posts? We already cover pretty much all the ground the games need to cover. If anything I think we need more management games in which you can actually lose. A post along them lines might create some sort of progress.
Saldor010
#179006813Wednesday, December 02, 2015 5:07 PM GMT

So instead of having genuinely fun games on Roblox again, you want games that trick people into thinking they're having fun?
morash
#179023310Wednesday, December 02, 2015 11:26 PM GMT

It's not necessarily "fake" fun, it's just a fake challenge.
sillsdog
#213472628Monday, April 03, 2017 11:00 PM GMT

Bumping post

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