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Raise is Swervedriver's only good album. |
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VexullJoin Date: 2010-02-05
Post Count: 5861 |
the fact that the genre contains the word 'post' before does not mean that the genre it originates from has ceased to exist all of a sudden. It's called post-rock because it is introducing new traits not commonly found in rock music, it's going beyond that of traditional rock music. It doesn't mean people have stopped making rock lol |
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I'm just saying the genre name doesn't make much sense. It implies something has ceased and that this genre is taking place after said genre has died. |
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>Hellary_Clynton
More like 'Hilarious Clinton.' |
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shoegaze is a vacuum that has been paulstretched and sung over with added drums
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VexullJoin Date: 2010-02-05
Post Count: 5861 |
"I'm just saying the genre name doesn't make much sense. It implies something has ceased and that this genre is taking place after said genre has died."
no it doesn't lol |
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>no it doesn't lol
Grammatically, it does. If you're reading a novel, like the Hunger Games for example, and the author says it is a post-Utopian universe, what does that mean? It surely doesn't mean that it's a completely new world where every amp comes with a crap load of reverb. It means it takes place after a Utopian world has fallen into desolation. If that doesn't help you out, let's try post-hardcore as an example. The first wave of hardcore ended during the late 90's. Then, the new wave of hardcore picked up around the early 2000's. Post-hardcore identifies as the successor to hardcore punk and since borrows from both punk and pop-punk music. The pop-punk influence is what distinguishes it from the original wave.
Notice how all of these instances use 'post' as a term meant for describing something that happened later. You can't invent a genre and use the term "post" as a completely new concept that isn't tied to a previous endeavor. That's both grammatically incorrect and flat-out stupid. |
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Loyal2OneJoin Date: 2012-06-24
Post Count: 10155 |
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VexullJoin Date: 2010-02-05
Post Count: 5861 |
Lol that's not completely true but I'm not going to even bother trying
And there are still new hardcore bands out there |
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That's because they decided to stick to the original format and not become a member of the post-hardcore universe. |
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VexullJoin Date: 2010-02-05
Post Count: 5861 |
yeah. so people still make hardcore. post-hardcore isn't the exact same thing but newer. anyway, using the prefix 'post-' the way that music genres do is still grammatically correct. in this way, 'post-____' implies that the genre came after and originated from ____ genre. not that ____ genre no longer exists. |
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You're proving my point. My question is: when did the future start, and if so, when did the original decline? |
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Loyal2OneJoin Date: 2012-06-24
Post Count: 10155 |
This thread is still alive?
LOL |
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Okay Raymond there are a lot of problems here, in fact I found one on every page so I decided to address some main points.
"Post-metal and post-rock are all jokes."
I'm going to assume you haven't listened to any post rock or atmospheric sludge (or post metal, which is another name for it), because they are both, while sometimes watered down with copycats of the great bands styles, fantastic genres. I'm not as big on atmospheric sludge but I'd recommend you listen to Neurosis, a band I cannot name but they have an album named "Oceanic" and "Panopticon", maybe some Pelican, to get a good feel for it.
As far as post rock:
Swans (Soundtracks for the Blind and modern stuff)
Godspeed You! Black Emperor!
Explosions In the Sky
Sigur Rós
Talk Talk
Tortoise
these are some fairly entry level bands but it will give you a good feel for the genre and they are some of the best. I could also go into a lot of skamz and powerviolence that takes from these genres but honestly I'm sure you aren't very interested.
"Shoegaze is basically pop with guitars."
Okay, shoegaze is pop, but this is very, very wrong. It is not just pop with guitars at all, but you are right, it's about the atmosphere. But also about the textures, it's a dense noisey wall of textures and melodies, that yes, certaintly have pop sensibilities. I'll get into your thing about no distortion in shoegaze (which is a baffling statement) next.
"Shoegaze is NOT distorted."
This is just objectively wrong, shoegaze is all about distorting the sound and using the guitar, run through tons of pedals (not just distortion, but a lot of distortion) to make a new texture out of the guitar, they call it shoegaze because the performers had to stare down during performances, at their pedals.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0dJqlvOSq4
Have you ever listened to any shoegaze? Or post rock or atmospheric sludge for that matter?
"The Beatles were a joke."
I mean, your opinion, but you have to know this is a completely wrong statement and that from 1965-1969 they were a completely groundbreaking band and insanely innovative... right?
"I have an amp setting for shoegaze and indie rock, so I would know."
Oh, oh no... that's not... shoegaze isn't just one sound man, it's about exploring new sounds and textures with your guitar, not just one straightforward sound.
"The Beatles have stood the test of time solely because they are overrated. What all have they done? Portray every rock stereotype? That's nothing to be proud of. They did nothing good for music aside from establish the most basic level of songwriting. None of their songs were 'complex' in any sense of the word. I can describe several other songs that have a more complex meaning than any Beatles song."
Goodness, I get it, The Beatles certaintly are overrated, that's fair. Personally I think they deserve it, but oh well. For one you have to realize a lot of these "rock stereotypes" they potrayed didn't exactly exist yet until they made them. They had a lot better songwriting than a lot of bands today even and certaintly more than a lot of stuff at the time. A lot of their songs were very musically complex, A Day In the Life, Strawberry Fields Forever, Blue Jay Way, Being For the Benefit of Mr. Kite, Happiness Is a Warm Gun, a lot more stuff man. I'm not gonna get into lyrical meanings with you because it's pretty pointless.
"You guys just don't want to admit that The Beatles choked music during the 60's. I mean really, their only claim to fame was that they were British and sang generic songs."
The exact opposite in fact, Raymond, the 60s musical scene was fairly desolate until we had stuff like Bob Dyland, The Beach Boys, The Beatles, The Velvet Underground, The Mothers of Invention, etc. There was great stuff to come out in the latter half of the 60s but the Beatles did the exact opposite of "choke" the music scene.
"The Beatles never ventured too deep into those waters, as they were more focused on easy listening and shallow themes."
That's objectively wrong though... idk, I feel like it'd take to much to explain things to you at this point.
"The Beatles kept their music in the same area to keep up appearances. Because of how influential everyone believed they were, they kept their lyrics and songs simple and to the point."
Dude come on, The Beatles evens stopped touring after Revolver so they could focus on music, and innovate. They did, with each album, do you really think they were trying to keep it simple and safe with Revolution 9 or A Day In the Life? Yeah I'm sure they were thinking "our fans would love if we did avant garde stuff inspired by Stockhausen."
"I have heard post-rock and post-metal. Like I said, the whole genre name is stupid. Just be rock. Be metal."
But it's different then rock and metal?????
"There's no need to entitle themselves as "post-rock" or "post-metal" because none of those genres are dead."
It isn't about rock or metal ending, it's about it being a different genre, post rock is about music made with rock instruments in non typical rock ways, doesn't have to be instrumental like you assumed, takes influences form a lot of different places.
Post metal is sludge metal that focuses on textures and atmosphere, they are different names because they are different things.
" Then, the new wave of hardcore picked up around the early 2000's. "
Post hardcore started in the 80s
"Post-hardcore identifies as the successor to hardcore punk and since borrows from both punk and pop-punk music. The pop-punk influence is what distinguishes it from the original wave."
That's... not what post hardcore is. Sure their are big poppy post hardcore bands but I'd suggest trying out some post hardcore like Slint, At the Drive-In, NoMeansNo, Refused, Fugazi, The Dismemberment Plan. And you can't forget that screamo (actual screamo) is a offshoot of post hardcore (and emo) which isn't influenced by pop punk at all, in fact there is a good amount of screamo influenced by post rock though like Envy or City of Caterpillar.
Wow that was a lot, please stop being so wrong. |
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Oh and I hope I described Shoegaze for you a bit Loyal, checkout My Bloody Valentine, it's a good starting place, and maybe some Ride. |
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Dr, most of what I said was relative anyways. I noticed how you didn't pick apart the song meanings I listed in contrast to The Beatles. I thought you would dig-in to Metallica and The Amity Affliction pretty hard. |
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It was going on for a while and didn't feel like going into it, One had a good idea lyrically but it's not like it was a completely new idea, was inspired by Johnny Got His Gun and I've seen an eerily similar concept in an episode of Alfred Hitchcock Presents. |
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But I am a bit taken back that you didn't even bother to refute anything, oh well. |
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That's because I know what I said was relative. I was just trying to support my thesis on how I don't find the genre to be 'post' anything. Contrary to popular belief, I have listened to both genres before. I just don't seem to find how any of them couldn't fit within their parent genres.
As for "One", the song itself is of Metallica's best, if not the best song they have. Although you are correct on your statement regarding its lyrics, the song does provide a lot of detail into the mental state of the subject. Sure, it could've gone a lot deeper into the mental state, but the solo captures the mood of the song in terms of the instant craze of thoughts and emotions the person is going through at the time. Having words you cannot speak, limbs you cannot move and thoughts that only you can hear is an experience no words can really express, but Metallica did a decent enough job of doing so.
As for The Amity Affliction, I don't really find an issue with the song. I believe that band writes their lyrics well. Songs like "Pittsburgh, "The Weigh Down", and "Chasing Ghosts" are some of the most thoughtfully written sentiments I've ever heard aside from "Don't Lean on Me". Even their new single "I Bring the Weather with Me" is lyrically concise. Even for a metalcore act, their lyrics are among the best. Though, I have to give Oli Sykes the top spot because his use of metaphors is amazing. Especially in "Shadow Moses". |
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My main gripe is you were objectively wrong about shoegaze. It's you decision to not like the genre name I suppose, I think it's fitting because it is beyond rock music, as for post metal, the actual name of the genre is atmospheric sludge.
I'm not debating whether or not those songs have meaning, I'm debating that the Beatles having meaning. |
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thebobxJoin Date: 2011-11-24
Post Count: 3596 |
shoegaze isnt music |
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yes I love city of caterpillar and at the drive in!
@drawesome
yaphet kotto, julia, breakwater, thursday, shoulder, morning again? |
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cool stuff my man
especially Thursday |
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thebobxJoin Date: 2011-11-24
Post Count: 3596 |
yo f### at the drive in |
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