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Psst, just gonna throw this in then jump out real quick......wage gap is real.....feminism kinda needed to fix that........alright, peace out. |
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DivlishJoin Date: 2013-01-22
Post Count: 5643 |
Was that a joke? Cause the wage gap has been disproved so many times it's no longer a theory.
wizard of ot |
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That was not a joke since according the US Department of Labor it is a real thing. Not really something that's been disproven.
I'll just copy and paste.
Surely it can’t be true. President Kennedy signed the Equal Pay Act in 1963. The very next year Congress passed Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which banned s*x discrimination at work. Yet nearly fifty years later, women still make less than men.
We live today in a world where women run Fortune 500 companies, sit on the Supreme Court, and push back the frontiers of knowledge. We live during a time when more young women than men hold bachelor’s degrees, and when women make up almost half of all new law school graduates. Given all our progress, there must be some explanation behind the fact that women still lag behind men when it comes to pay equity.
Earlier this week, the Paycheck Fairness Act failed to advance in the Senate, triggering a new round of conversation about the pay gap and what the numbers really mean. Research shows that even though equal pay for women is a legal right, it is not yet a reality. Despite the evidence, myths that women’s choices or other legitimate factors are the “real” cause of the pay gap persist. So does confusion about how to measure the gap and what figures to use. That’s why today, we are going to bust a few myths.
MYTH: Saying women only earn 77 cents on the dollar is a huge exaggeration – the “real” pay gap is much smaller than that (if it even exists).
REALITY: The size of the pay gap depends on how you measure it. The most common estimate is based on differences in annual earnings (currently about 23 cents difference per dollar). Another approach uses weekly earnings data (closer to an 18- or 19-cent difference). Analyzing the weekly figures can be more precise in certain ways, like accounting for work hours that vary over the course of the year, and less accurate in others, like certain forms of compensation that don’t get paid as weekly wages. No matter which number you start with, the differences in pay for women and men really add up. According to one analysis by the Department of Labor’s Chief Economist, a typical 25-year-old woman working full time would have already earned $5,000 less over the course of her working career than a typical 25-year old man. If that earnings gap is not corrected, by age 65, she will have lost hundreds of thousands of dollars over her working lifetime. We also know that women earn less than men in every state and region of the country, and that once you factor in race, the pay gap for women of color is even larger.
MYTH: There is no such thing as the gender pay gap – legitimate differences between men and women cause the gap in pay, not discrimination.
REALITY: Decades of research shows a gender gap in pay even after factors like the kind of work performed and qualifications (education and experience) are taken into account. These studies consistently conclude that discrimination is the best explanation of the remaining difference in pay. Economists generally attribute about 40% of the pay gap to discrimination – making about 60% explained by differences between workers or their jobs. However, even the “explained” differences between men and women might be more complicated. For example: If high school girls are discouraged from taking the math and science classes that lead to high-paying STEM jobs, shouldn’t we in some way count that as a lost equal earnings opportunity? As one commentator put it recently, “I don’t think that simply saying we have 9 cents of discrimination and then 14 cents of life choices is very satisfying.” In other words, no matter how you slice the data, pay discrimination is a real and persistent problem that continues to shortchange American women and their families.
MYTH: But the pay gap is not my problem. Once you account for the jobs that require specialized skills or education it goes away.
REALITY: The pay gap for women with advanced degrees, corporate positions, and high paying, high skill jobs is just as real as the gap for workers overall. In a recent study of newly trained doctors, even after considering the effects of specialty, practice setting, work hours and other factors, the gender pay gap was nearly $17,000 in 2008. Catalyst reviewed 2011 government data showing a gender pay gap for women lawyers, and that data confirms that the gap exists for a range of professional and technical occupations. In fact, according to a study by the Institute for Women’s Policy Research that used information from the Bureau of Labor Statistics, women earn less than men even within the same occupations. Despite differences in the types of jobs women and men typically perform, women earn less than men in male dominated occupations (such as managers, software developers and CEO’s) and in those jobs commonly filled by women (like teachers, nurses and receptionists). In a recent review of 2010 Census data, Bloomberg found only one of 285 major occupations where women’s median pay was higher than that of men – personal care and service workers. Because the data showed a particularly large pay gap in the financial sector, Bloomberg suggested that for women on Wall Street, shining shoes was the best way to earn more than the men.
MYTH: Women are responsible for the pay gap because they seek out flexible jobs or choose to work fewer hours. Putting family above work is why women earn less.
REALITY: Putting aside whether it’s right to ask women (or men) to sacrifice financially in order to work and have a family, those kinds of choices aren’t enough to explain away the gender pay gap. The gender gap in pay exists for women working full time. Taking time off for children also doesn’t explain gaps at the start of a career. And although researchers have addressed various ways that work hours or schedule might or might not explain some portion of the wage gap, there may be a “motherhood penalty.” This is based on nothing more than the expectation that mothers will work less. Researchers have found that merely the status of being a mother can lead to perceptions of lowered competence and commitment and lower salary offers.
MYTH: We don’t need to do anything, the gender pay gap will eventually go away by itself.
REALITY: It has been nearly fifty years since Congress mandated equal pay for women, and we still have a pay gap. There is evidence that our initial progress in closing the gap has slowed. We can’t sit back and wait decades more. Just this year the Department of Labor launched an app challenge, working to give women the tools they need to know their worth. My office continues to increase its enforcement of requirements that federal contractors pay workers without discriminating on the basis of race or gender. And we are teaming up with other members of the National Equal Pay Task Force to ensure a coordinated federal response to equal pay enforcement. You can read more about our work on equal pay here.
The pay gap isn’t a myth, it’s a reality – and it’s our job to fix it.
Editor’s Note: The author, Dr. Pamela Coukos is a Senior Program Advisor at the Department of Labor’s Office of Federal Contract Compliance Programs. |
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@Powder
If women are paid less than men for equal work, why have men in the workforce at all if you have to pay them more just for being a man? Oh wait, maybe it's because there isn't a wage gap or men have been working those jobs longer in their lifetimes. |
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BMLGUYJoin Date: 2011-07-20
Post Count: 36711 |
"wage gap is real.....feminism kinda needed to fix that........alright, peace out."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n5E7feJHw0
"your and your're actually pretty much means the same thing. and your is a real word." -Crasymanjr03 | This is my siggy. There are many like it, but this one is mine. |
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@Jiant.(Yes, that was intentional mispelling, :P ).
My guess is that men are hired more than women for roughly the same reason a man would be paid more than a woman.
1.They think the men is more qualified for the job.
2.They believe men will be easier to work with.
3.They believe that women will have issues with pr*gnancy or other things that would heavily impact their job.
4.A man walking in saying "I'm the best there is, hire me for the job." is seen as confident and worthy. A woman doing the same is generally viewed as "Oh my god she's such an arrogant jerk, let's not hire her, since she's acting like she's better than everyone else". |
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@BML.
Thanks for the youtube clip, I might actually use that someday. :D . |
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BMLGUYJoin Date: 2011-07-20
Post Count: 36711 |
but seriously, the wage gap doesn't exist
also if you could post a source that'd be nice
"your and your're actually pretty much means the same thing. and your is a real word." -Crasymanjr03 | This is my siggy. There are many like it, but this one is mine. |
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LithileixJoin Date: 2016-08-09
Post Count: 111 |
I'm bi, and the issue doesn't need attention, nobody needs to care anymore, it already happened, and we're definitely not technically oppressed anywhere but one state.
Nobody needs to care anymore. I don't think most SJW people who idolize us LGBT people understand that we think for ourselves and the majority of us don't want some huge attention spree celebration. |
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Not allowed to directly post links, but you can just take a small section, copy it, paste it into google, and voila, it should show up.
In fact I just tested it with the Editors note of it, "The author, Dr. Pamela Coukos is a Senior Program Advisor at the Department of Labor’s Office of Federal Contract Compliance Programs.", threw it into google, and the second result was the one I used. Myth Busting the Pay Gap: U.S. Department of Labor. |
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i dont really have time to argue with you nor do i care (not american) so im only going to partially address some stuff (also gotta go to washroom)
"We live today in a world where women run Fortune 500 companies, sit on the Supreme Court, and push back the frontiers of knowledge. We live during a time when more young women than men hold bachelor’s degrees, and when women make up almost half of all new law school graduates. Given all our progress, there must be some explanation behind the fact that women still lag behind men when it comes to pay equity."
There was a study that found that women ask for promotions/raises WAAAAY LESS than men. That's one reason right there.
"Earlier this week, the Paycheck Fairness Act failed to advance in the Senate, triggering a new round of conversation about the pay gap and what the numbers really mean. Research shows that even though equal pay for women is a legal right, it is not yet a reality. Despite the evidence, myths that women’s choices or other legitimate factors are the “real” cause of the pay gap persist. So does confusion about how to measure the gap and what figures to use. That’s why today, we are going to bust a few myths."
Wait so it's a right but no woman in the world is using it? Ever heard of lawsuits or court? Come on.
"MYTH: Saying women only earn 77 cents on the dollar is a huge exaggeration – the “real” pay gap is much smaller than that (if it even exists).
REALITY: The size of the pay gap depends on how you measure it. The most common estimate is based on differences in annual earnings (currently about 23 cents difference per dollar). Another approach uses weekly earnings data (closer to an 18- or 19-cent difference). Analyzing the weekly figures can be more precise in certain ways, like accounting for work hours that vary over the course of the year, and less accurate in others, like certain forms of compensation that don’t get paid as weekly wages. No matter which number you start with, the differences in pay for women and men really add up. According to one analysis by the Department of Labor’s Chief Economist, a typical 25-year-old woman working full time would have already earned $5,000 less over the course of her working career than a typical 25-year old man. If that earnings gap is not corrected, by age 65, she will have lost hundreds of thousands of dollars over her working lifetime. We also know that women earn less than men in every state and region of the country, and that once you factor in race, the pay gap for women of color is even larger."
But how does this work out into the scheme of spending things? Are they working the same position? The same project? What field of work are they doing?
"MYTH: There is no such thing as the gender pay gap – legitimate differences between men and women cause the gap in pay, not discrimination.
REALITY: Decades of research shows a gender gap in pay even after factors like the kind of work performed and qualifications (education and experience) are taken into account. These studies consistently conclude that discrimination is the best explanation of the remaining difference in pay."
Why is it discrimination? Are women also earning less at companies owned by women?
"Economists generally attribute about 40% of the pay gap to discrimination – making about 60% explained by differences between workers or their jobs."
Who are these Economists and where is their proof that their views are unbiased and that their statistics are true to the entire population?
However, even the “explained” differences between men and women might be more complicated. For example: If high school girls are discouraged from taking the math and science classes that lead to high-paying STEM jobs, shouldn’t we in some way count that as a lost equal earnings opportunity?
Who discourages them? Family? Teacher? Obama? Boyfriend? Baby? Employer? God?
What about other explained differences?
Also, being discouraged =/= lost equal earning opportunity. The greatest billionaires, athletes, and world-changers had tons of discouragement, but did that stop them? No. It motivated them.
"As one commentator put it recently,"
What is the credibility, relevance, and identity of this person?
MYTH: We don’t need to do anything, the gender pay gap will eventually go away by itself.
"REALITY: It has been nearly fifty years since Congress mandated equal pay for women, and we still have a pay gap. There is evidence that our initial progress in closing the gap has slowed. We can’t sit back and wait decades more. Just this year the Department of Labor launched an app challenge, working to give women the tools they need to know their worth. My office continues to increase its enforcement of requirements that federal contractors pay workers without discriminating on the basis of race or gender. And we are teaming up with other members of the National Equal Pay Task Force to ensure a coordinated federal response to equal pay enforcement. You can read more about our work on equal pay here."
The first labor union legalized in 1955. Up until then, men didn't have a right to strike, have a minimum wage, safety, and many other things. Women were given equal pay to men only ten years after men could get a minimum pay, but women didn't have to bite the bullet as hard.
"The pay gap isn’t a myth, it’s a reality – and it’s our job to fix it."
Nothing in life should come free.
dont argue with me because im officially ignoring this thread and taking a dump |
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You could also copy and paste this section from a HuffingtonPost article into google.
"One of the most common arguments made about the gender pay gap is that it simply doesn’t exist. Take this Wall Street Journal op-ed lamenting the “The ‘Wage Gap’ Myth That Won’t Die,” or this one from CBS Money Watch that asserts “The Gender Pay Gap Is A Complete Myth.” Read the comments in just about any article on the subject. Pay gap deniers abound. "
It's a much more updated source than the previous one, and provides a lot more information and sources of its own.
Granted some may say that the HuffingtonPost could be biased, but hey, most people only point out that something is biased if it disagrees with them. :P .
For example one time me and a guy were debating whether or not Obama has been a good president, I used a democratic website titled THE List of 371 Obama Accomplishments so far, With Citations while the other guy used a source called 22 REASONS WHY YOU SHOULD HATE OBAMA. Obviously neither of these sources can possibly be unbiased, but we only pointed it out when it was disagreeing with us....so bleh. :P .....not really a point to this but oh well. |
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BMLGUYJoin Date: 2011-07-20
Post Count: 36711 |
the wage gap doesn't exist and most arguments by femin4z1's are flawed
"your and your're actually pretty much means the same thing. and your is a real word." -Crasymanjr03 | This is my siggy. There are many like it, but this one is mine. |
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"There was a study that found that women ask for promotions/raises WAAAAY LESS than men. That's one reason right there.".
I could also show you some studies showing that women asking for raises and promotions are much more likely to NOT be taken seriously, be declined, and so on. Or a study showing that women asking for raises are seen as overly bossy and aggressive while men doing the same are viewed as confident and bleh bleh.
"Wait so it's a right but no woman in the world is using it? Ever heard of lawsuits or court? Come on.".
Not everyone has the time, energy, patience, or money to file a lawsuit and follow it all the way through. Plus the fact that doing so would pretty much be a huge black mark on their job history. 'Oh hey, this women sued her company for not paying her more!?. WHAT A GREEDY LADY'. If she ever has to change jobs she would be a lot less likely to be hired since someone openly suing their place of work most likely would be more than willing to do the same to their new work place.
"But how does this work out into the scheme of spending things? Are they working the same position? The same project? What field of work are they doing?".
You'll have to look at the individual studies themselves for that sort of info, and the original source from this(just copy and paste a section to google, you'll find it) I'm fairly certain sourced their info. Just check there as I'm too lazy to. :P .
"Why is it discrimination? Are women also earning less at companies owned by women?".
Well there is at least one study if I recall correctly saying that. For example, nursing, a job industry dominated by women, actually still has women getting paid less than men. There was also another study I vaguely remember reading a year or so back about professors at a medical college being asked what they think a potential employee(with resume provided) should be paid. The study found that both male and female professors consistently wanted to give women less pay than men, though it was much higher of a difference for the male professors than the difference for female professors. You could use this as a way to say both genders are biased towards women though, because hey, if I'm going to provide information I should avoid cherry picking, even if it means giving the opposing debater free info to use. :P .
"Who are these Economists and where is their proof that their views are unbiased and that their statistics are true to the entire population?".
You'll have to go to the original source for that, as mentioned previously.
"Who discourages them? Family? Teacher? Obama? Boyfriend? Baby? Employer? God?
What about other explained differences?
Also, being discouraged =/= lost equal earning opportunity. The greatest billionaires, athletes, and world-changers had tons of discouragement, but did that stop them? No. It motivated them.
I'm not a big fan of that section of the article, so I have nothing to say about this in opposition to what you said.
"What is the credibility, relevance, and identity of this person?".
Same as previous two instances of this sort of question.
"The first labor union legalized in 1955. Up until then, men didn't have a right to strike, have a minimum wage, safety, and many other things. Women were given equal pay to men only ten years after men could get a minimum pay, but women didn't have to bite the bullet as hard.".
I'm lazy so I'm copy and pasting the earliest record of a woman asking for equal pay to men, as according to TIME.
In February, 1869, a letter to the editor of the New York Times questioned why female government employees were not paid the same as male ones. “Very few persons deny the justice of the principle that equal work should command equal pay without regard to the s*x of the laborer,” the author wrote. “But it is one thing to acknowledge the right of a principle and quite another to practice it.” The author noted that the U.S. Government employed 500 women in the Treasury department, but that they made only half as much as their male colleagues:.
"Nothing in life should come free.
dont argue with me because im officially ignoring this thread and taking a dump".
Eww, did not need that info. |
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@BML.
Please take the time to thoroughly read up on the sources I "provided"(CURSE YOU ROBLOX FOR MAKING PEOPLE HAVE TO GOOGLE KEY PHRASES INSTEAD OF CLICKING LINKS).], it's much more effective than immediately assuming an argument is invalid because of femin@zis. I have no idea where you got the idea that anything I talked about had to do with those people. The closest I came to them was saying feminists are needed, which are NOT femin@zis. Other than that there was no mention nor connection them. |
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PectrialJoin Date: 2014-04-16
Post Count: 3582 |
"no it doesn't"
>Yes it does search up the meaning of credibility. If at least Jesus was a real person it shows that the book might not be just a random
"except i can, and i have"
>No you just have made something up as if you know what the thoughts of a God like that would have.
"yes, it's called jail-time. not facing eternal peril in the depths of hell."
You ask for proof and you think I am a bigot when you are basically being a bigot here. All you are doing is posting your opinion and however sensible what I say is you are just writing your opinion down.
I could say "no it's not called jail time it's called eternal peril" but I don't because I actually try think of a good argument.
"i'm going to let this sink in for a moment. this is probably the dumbest thing i've read all day. you just said that because god wants to discriminate against certain groups of people, that EVERYONE should. you ####ing idiot."
>No, no you aren't spy out think this is letting it sink you think you should be the one forgiving me? You think all your countless insults and idiocy and hypocrisy (bigot) is actually not dumb? You are probably gonna say yes. That's just your actions. Here we go let me show you how to debate.
The word bigot is not anything to do with discrimination all though I don't think God discriminates. You can't discriminate if you know for a fact (he did create the world) that what you are saying is true. For example the mountain is on fire. You saw the fire. You go down and people say IT ISNT TRUE, they haven't seen the fire however you have. In fact you saw the fire being created. Is it discrimination to shout at the people to get the the car to leave? Anyway bigotry is the intolerance to those who hold a different opinion from your own. The same way you won't call the person who knows and saw the fire the bigot. If God exists he cannot be called a bigot.
"If you don't respect stupidity then you would probably try not be so toxic for that is stupidity."
toxicity =/= stupidity
>it practically does you need some stupidity to be toxic because it is a stupid thing to do.
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rose6666Join Date: 2011-06-19
Post Count: 6541 |
I'm a dedicated feminist, but the wage gap doesn't exist. Women earn, on average, less than men because the jobs they are in generally pay less than men. It's a case of misunderstanding statistics. |
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PectrialJoin Date: 2014-04-16
Post Count: 3582 |
Yes finally rose to put some sense into this debate. |
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Rodash22Join Date: 2012-09-29
Post Count: 1178 |
I stopped taking rose seriously when she said she's a dedicated feminist. |
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PectrialJoin Date: 2014-04-16
Post Count: 3582 |
^She maybe a feminist but she actually can debate unlike may others. |
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rose6666Join Date: 2011-06-19
Post Count: 6541 |
@rodash
Being a feminist doesn't mean you hate men and want women to have a superior amount of rights to them. It simply means that I support women and men having equal opportunities and rights.
The word "feminism" has been twisted into a negative thing thanks to the radical feminists on Tumblr. I don't agree with their ways of thinking and protesting, I think they're extremely regressive despite what they like to think.
Another myth is that being a liberal who supports feminism and the LGBT community means I'm a rabid SJW who will attack you for making a joke. I mean to be honest I love racist/sexist/g@y jokes, I think they're hilarious. So please, refrain from calling me a "libtard" or some other overused phrase that conservatives always use against left wingers. |
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BLOCOSSJoin Date: 2008-11-09
Post Count: 516 |
@PowerH
You don't understand business if you think they would hire someone for their quality over their price, why do you think a lot of jobs are done by illegal? Because they are really cheap, not because they are better.
So no, if wage gap was real, women would hired a lot more often because they would be cheap workforce (and as such, things such as maternity leaves could be easily filled by another cheap worker without making a noticeable difference)
@Rodash
I don't like feminist either but Rose is alright, at least she have arguments unlike most fem.
@Rose
Damn libt- Oh wait, I was pretty much you for years.
Feminism is like a basket full of oranges with the rotten ones at the bottom, if you don't remove them it rot the entire basket and you end up throwing it with all the good one remaining.
Of course even if people are feminists for the right reasons, it's fairly obvious radicals do have pretty much the power over it and got to decide what should be done. |
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rose6666Join Date: 2011-06-19
Post Count: 6541 |
I like to think of it more in terms of Islam's current problems. I really like your orange analogy though, mind if I steal it, lol?
Unfortunately you're right that the radicals seem to have more say. I think it's because people give them too much attention. They're always publicised; people are always saying "omg trigerd lolol!" or "lol SJW" at things which is just fuelling the radicals even more.
I, and other feminists, have a better chance at silencing the radical feminists than conservatives/republicans do because we can use their own logic against them and show that, no, we do not stand for this. If conservatives stand against them they'll just jump to the "omg misogynist" "i drink your man tears" without trying to accept their logic. |
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rose6666Join Date: 2011-06-19
Post Count: 6541 |
Fem1n1sm 1s l1ke Isl4m - th3r3's th3 m4jority, th3 Musl1ms, wh0 are p34ceful and just w4nt t0 g0 0ut and l1ve their l1fe. |
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