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Zebra,
you just shot down your own argument. |
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ZebraPloxJoin Date: 2012-06-13
Post Count: 2925 |
No.
I stated that if someone just doesn't like the idea overall, they don't need reasons.
But, they'll need reasons if they just say, purely 'No support'.
Saying 'No support' doesn't actually give much feedback.
Depending on why they don't support may or may not need reasons.
Saying you don't like the idea shouldn't need any reasons, because they've stated they just don't like it, but its some sort of feedback.
If they want to go beyond not liking it, and want to try finding negative things in the suggestion, that's when they'll need some valid reasons.
Example:
"Umm... No. Personally, I just don't like this idea..."
Should be acceptable without any reasoning.
"No support."
Reasoning.
"This has flaws."
Reasoning.
"This may be good for some users, but, for the overall amount of players it would be useless. Plus, I don't really like this idea."
Ok.
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Your examples are invalid.
""Umm... No. Personally, I just don't like this idea...""
WHY doesn't said person like this idea.
""No support.""
This is literally just saying you don't support, which without any reasoning at all, means you probably do support, but dislike the OP.
""This has flaws.""
WHAT flaws.
"This may be good for some users, but, for the overall amount of players it would be useless. Plus, I don't really like this idea."
WHAT group of users would it benefit.
WHAT group of users wouldn't use it.
Why wouldn't they use it?
Why should your opinion determine your logical decisions?
Using any of those example as an excuse to not support simply does not give enough information for your lack of support to be valid.
Therefor, your argument collapses on itself.
̿ ̿̿ ̿’̿’\̵͇̿̿\з=(◣_◢)=ε/̵͇̿̿/’̿’̿ ̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿
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ZebraPloxJoin Date: 2012-06-13
Post Count: 2925 |
By these two:
""No support."
Reasoning.
"This has flaws."
Reasoning."
I put "Reasoning", because it WOULD need reasons.
__
As for the others, think of them as 'templates'.
But, overall, if someone doesn't like an idea, you shouldn't expect them to give much reasoning, since their opinion lies on not liking it.
We post suggestions to see if the rest of the community likes them or not;
They told you they don't like it.
No need to question and bug them trying to make them give some type of reasoning just for not liking it.
I'm not saying not liking the idea should count as a 'non support', but, if people don't like the idea overall, they gave you some type feedback, and that type of feedback wouldn't lie under 'no support' or 'support', but rather, 'oh, this person didn't like it, oh well'.
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And all I'm saying is they should at least give some sort of reason to dislike the idea. In order prove they aren't hating the idea, just for the sake of hating it, you see. |
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ZebraPloxJoin Date: 2012-06-13
Post Count: 2925 |
Hating the idea is something entirely different.
Not liking shouldn't need much reasons, if not, none.
Hating it, would really need some good reasons, since you feel so much negativity for it. |
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From a purely logical standpoint, disliking an idea has to have some kind of reason.
If you dislike and idea, just for the sake of disliking and idea, then you're probably a troll.
̿ ̿̿ ̿’̿’\̵͇̿̿\з=(◣_◢)=ε/̵͇̿̿/’̿’̿ ̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ |
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ZebraPloxJoin Date: 2012-06-13
Post Count: 2925 |
"From a purely logical standpoint, disliking an idea has to have some kind of reason."
Yes, and, most of those reasons may be opinionated as well.
When someone just says they don't like it, leave it be.
You've gotten some feedback; one person doesn't like your idea.
The only time reasons should actually be necessary is if someone doesn't support it for different reasons that are beyond their own opinion.
"If you dislike and idea, just for the sake of disliking and idea, then you're probably a troll."
But they don't dislike it just to dislike it.
They dislike the idea because in their own opinion, they don't like it.
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"They dislike the idea because in their own opinion, they don't like it.They dislike the idea because in their own opinion, they don't like it."
They have to backup their opinion somehow. If they don't they are just shouting empty words.
̿ ̿̿ ̿’̿’\̵͇̿̿\з=(◣_◢)=ε/̵͇̿̿/’̿’̿ ̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ |
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ZebraPloxJoin Date: 2012-06-13
Post Count: 2925 |
"They have to backup their opinion somehow."
Since it's in their own opinion, it won't possibly do much.
They don't like it.
You like it.
Reasoning wouldn't change anything.
It may help somewhat, but, don't expect much, because you ARE getting some sort of feedback.
"If they don't they are just shouting empty words."
Possibly.
But, as I said before, reasons may also be opinionated. Meaning, it won't possibly do much for either side.
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"But, as I said before, reasons may also be opinionated. Meaning, it won't possibly do much for either side."
It's better than no reasons.
̿ ̿̿ ̿’̿’\̵͇̿̿\з=(◣_◢)=ε/̵͇̿̿/’̿’̿ ̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ ̿̿ |
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misty82Join Date: 2010-10-01
Post Count: 630 |
Cat Fight Meow. XD But in all seriousness support :3 |
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MaoakJoin Date: 2007-10-19
Post Count: 137 |
Support. |
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watevs44Join Date: 2009-11-07
Post Count: 9172 |
Zebra,
"'No support' can also count as they just don't like the idea.
They're not going to support an idea they personally don't like.
No, it cannot. Simply not liking the idea is invalid reasoning to No Support. If you cannot find any flaws with the idea, there is no rational and/or logical reasoning for you to not like it and more importantly to not lend your Support.
And you can bet your cotton candy, I'll take that as a Support if all the only reasons you're defying me are irrational intangible reasons.
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"It also makes no sense to give reasoning to an opinionated 'no support'."
Why are you bring opinions into this? S&I is supposed to be as objective as possible.
I think I'm seeing your problem here.
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"If they don't like it, they don't need reasoning"
MasterChiefAlpha and the District Attorney from the Milky way would beg to differ. It is against intergalactic law to not give reasons for No Supporting.
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"because we post suggestions to see whether the community likes it, or not, and whether there's flaws, or not."
"Not liking the idea" is expected but not sufficient in No Supporting. What truly matters is any apparent flaws.
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"If someone states they don't like it, they shouldn't give reasoning unless they want to go beyond from 'just not liking it', to, 'I want to find flaws in it so people agree on not to add it'; Which would obviously include some sort of reasoning."
Gasp! Are you condoning debating without substantiation?! With this kind of lazy happy-go-lucky thinking, debates would be full of rubbish. Logic would be destroyed! Oh the horror.
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"I stated that if someone just doesn't like the idea overall, they don't need reasons."
If they are going to No Support, it is forbidden to not come equipped with reasons. Not liking the idea isn't sufficient reasoning.
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"Saying 'No support' doesn't actually give much feedback.
Depending on why they don't support may or may not need reasons."
No Supports should always have reasons. As stated many times earlier
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"Saying you don't like the idea shouldn't need any reasons, because they've stated they just don't like it, but its some sort of feedback."
> some sort of feedback
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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"If they want to go beyond not liking it, and want to try finding negative things in the suggestion, that's when they'll need some valid reasons."
See everything above.
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"Umm... No. Personally, I just don't like this idea..."
WHY DON'T YOU LIKE THE IDEA. THE SOLANA GALAZY POLICE ARE GONNA LOCK YOU UP IF YOU DON'T HAVE YOUR REASONING
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"This may be good for some users, but, for the overall amount of players it would be useless. Plus, I don't really like this idea."
This is the only valid piece of reasoning you've demonstrated. More importantly however, the last sentence is totally irrelevant.
!Dream Crusher Strikes Again:3 |
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watevs44Join Date: 2009-11-07
Post Count: 9172 |
Zebra,
Hooray, I have more to rebut!
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"But, overall, if someone doesn't like an idea, you shouldn't expect them to give much reasoning, since their opinion lies on not liking it."
There must be reason for not liking something. Reasons you must vocalize if you want "I don't like it", to be a valid post.
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"We post suggestions to see if the rest of the community likes them or not;
They told you they don't like it.
No need to question and bug them trying to make them give some type of reasoning just for not liking it."
"I don't like it" is a sort of an empty baseplate.
You have to build on it and in it, to make it worthwhile.
Yeah, you can not like it. YOU HAVE TO HAVE REASONS FOR IT TO BE WORTH SOMETHING
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"I'm not saying not liking the idea should count as a 'non support', but, if people don't like the idea overall, they gave you some type feedback, and that type of feedback wouldn't lie under 'no support' or 'support', but rather, 'oh, this person didn't like it, oh well'."
"NO SUPPORT" IS THE VERDICT, "I DON'T LIKE IT" IS THE BLANKET TERM AND VERY BROAD, UNSUBSTANTIATED, WORTHLESS REASON FOR NO SUPPORTING, YOU THEN HAVE TO FINISH IT OFF WITH THE AFOREMENTIONED SUBSTANTIATION AND REASONING FOR YOUR POST TO BE WORTH SOMETHING. CAPSLOCK FURY
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"Hating the idea is something entirely different.
Not liking shouldn't need much reasons, if not, none.
Hating it, would really need some good reasons, since you feel so much negativity for it."
Your problem is that you're making foruming subjective. Foruming must be objective.
In other words: See everything above
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"Yes, and, most of those reasons may be opinionated as well."
See 1 above.
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"When someone just says they don't like it, leave it be."
Maybe you want to let it be, but I want to propel myself as a forumer and propel my ideas to being the best. That's not gonna happen if I leave the gateway open for bad foruming and illogical debates to run a muck
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"You've gotten some feedback; one person doesn't like your idea."
That's not feedback at all. This forum would fall into an eternal loop of please-no and with logic. Criticism is the only way of moving forward. Feedback is a basis for improvement. No one can improve if they don't know what's wrong.
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"The only time reasons should actually be necessary is if someone doesn't support it for different reasons that are beyond their own opinion."
Their own opinion should not be in this equation. A general rule of thumb for foruming is if the idea brings good and has no genuine issues, you Support or you don't post. That's the path to good, objective, wholesome and valid foruming.
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"But they don't dislike it just to dislike it."
How do we know? They haven't given any valid reasons why they don't support.
See, without reasoning, everyone falls to chaos.
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"They dislike the idea because in their own opinion, they don't like it."
Leave your opinions at the door, they'll do nothing but cloud your judgement.
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"Since it's in their own opinion, it won't possibly do much.
They don't like it.
You like it."
See the above
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"Reasoning wouldn't change anything."
Reasoning is everything.
Alongside intent, timing, context, reality checks and expectations.
Whoops! Wrong dimensions!
Still, reasoning is everything here.
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"It may help somewhat, but, don't expect much,"
You've been around long enough to know this statement is false. CRITICISM IS THE ONLY POSSIBLE WAY TO IMPROVE!!! IT MAKES THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCE IN OUR IDEAS. SO DON'T SAY "SOMEWHAT" BECAUSE "SOMEWHAT" IS A "BIG WHAT". IT'S THE ONLY WAY ANYTHING GETS DONE AROUND HERE.
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"because you ARE getting some sort of feedback."
See the above rebuttals.
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"Possibly."
You misspelled definitely.
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"But, as I said before, reasons may also be opinionated. Meaning, it won't possibly do much for either side."
And as I said before, this is where you're going wrong.
!Dream Crusher Strikes Again:3 |
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watevs44Join Date: 2009-11-07
Post Count: 9172 |
Probably shouldn't have drank that can of condescending juice before I typed all that out.
But I still stand by everything I've said.
Bumping as well!
!Dream Crusher Strikes Again:3 |
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ZebraPloxJoin Date: 2012-06-13
Post Count: 2925 |
How dare you use logic to completely destroy me.
This is absurd. >;o |
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5h2Join Date: 2012-09-22
Post Count: 15 |
support |
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Support, my little cousin plays ROBLOX occasionally and this would apply greatly towards him |
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maybe a better idea would be a remember username system, it could have three options: no thanks, sure, ill make an account later, and ok, lets go ahead and make the account! |
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I've always wanted to be friends w/ a guest :o
SUPPORT |
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