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Aledriv
#172234388Monday, August 24, 2015 3:14 AM GMT

Alright, first off Id like to say Iv have immense experience with being a High Ranking Official for quite the few clans, so I know what works and what doesn't. During this forum I will be explaining to the best of my ability's why we should change the current way trainings and promotions take place. Lets start with trainings. As you all should know by now, trainings happen well over six or seven times per day. That's ridiculous, even by an active clan like TRA's standards. At the very most, trainings should be limited to three times per day. Once in the afternoon around 3PM EST, Another around 6PM EST and the final one around 9PM EST. Having a training during the afternoon takes into account school and possible jobs most users have. How trainings should work, TL;DR version: - Three [Official] trainings per day, all in the afternoon starting at 3PM, then 6PM, and finally at 9PM. Now lets move over to the promotion system. In only two days Iv already achieved the rank of Staff Sergent, although I have a very advanced strategic mind and defensive skills, I find it ridiculous. It should have taken me a week at the very least. Every training I went to I was either promoted or recommened because I was far superior then everyone (Although the Elites provided a good struggle) How the promotion system should properly work, is like the following: - There should be a point system, for each rank a user must gain a set amount of points, the user can also only gain a maximum of 3 points per day, and 1 point per training. - Once a player gets to staff sergeant, they should be able to apply for a higher rank, an appointed HR would review that application and then test that person for said skills. This would reduce the ineffective HR's, so we wouldn't have to reform nearly as often. Alright, with all that being said, id like impute and thoughts on this subject. I already have support from a few HR's, whom, to protect identities I will not be naming at their digression.
Asceno
#172234862Monday, August 24, 2015 3:20 AM GMT

'Limit trainings' Activity would die so bad along with training places will have to be expanded and will lag a ton. No thanks man.....
Subwoofer6
#172235107Monday, August 24, 2015 3:24 AM GMT

If I may, I'd like to offer some feedback- based on my TRA Experience. 1. The times don't benefit BST (GMT) or CET users; I can only see them being beneficial to American/Canadian Users 2. This is an issue I've mentioned on the wall; so I won't repeat myself at this moment in time. 3. The point system was attempted by TRA Elites Academy; which ultimately fell through. 4. This is essentially a refined version of the Lieutenant system, which I support it's revival. Well done though; this could be quite an efficient system ,none-the-less, although it could be improved if a few tweaks are added here and there. Outside the box thinking is extremely useful and very much needed, I feel. :') -sub-a-dub-dub-
Aledriv
#172235404Monday, August 24, 2015 3:28 AM GMT

Do explain why a training place will need to be expanded? We only ever get 18 - 25 people per training. Besides that, I never said we couldn't have more then one server for trainings during the designated time. And Activity will easily stay high if we switch out the plentiful trainings with practice raids. To many units disregard commands and just go for kills during raids. They need to learn tactics and how to properly get the objective. During the raid on 8/23/2015 for example, I was commanding the raid, and only four people listened to my orders, and every one else decided to go strictly for kills. Because of that we lost the base twice, however we pulled out in the very end barley after everyone decided to listen when we lost the flag for the second time.
Aledriv
#172235618Monday, August 24, 2015 3:30 AM GMT

@Subwoofer6 Yea, I'm terribly sorry I couldn't include all the details. I actually have about three pages of information in explicit detail. However this is the very shortened version. Tomorrow in team speak, id like to get the HR's and DrDr together, aswell as the other units to effectively create a working system. What we are using currently just isn't working out. Especially they way people are promoted.
theFlashotic
#172236046Monday, August 24, 2015 3:36 AM GMT

I think a point system similar to wij isn't a bad idea, however I think points should not be limited by the event. I think there should be more points awarded for doing we ll at a PR than points awarded for doing well at a training. (I.e. Trainings you can gain 1-10 points, PRs or actual Defenses yiu can earn 1-15) As for the officer system, the current one we have I think is a good one. And about the times and number of trainings, I say there dent have to be a limit, but there shouldnt be more than about 5 trainings. Because there's people from every region everyone needs to have a chance for a training. Gj on this proposal. D-O-Double G
Aledriv
#172236286Monday, August 24, 2015 3:39 AM GMT

Thank you Snoopy, and I fully agree with your statement. I'm hoping to have a meeting tomorrow to further discuss this into much more detail. And its not that I don't like how the clan is currently, I just find it very tedious and quite complicated the way its currently running. I believe we can simplify things and create an easier workload for everyone, whilst improving activity level's and possibly gaining more members at the same time.
Twister4057
#172236556Monday, August 24, 2015 3:42 AM GMT

I do not approve of the limited trainings, or the credit system. If we use the credit system we will end up like RAT, VS, or even SCR....
Aledriv
#172237301Monday, August 24, 2015 3:53 AM GMT

That's not a very convincing argument. We will discuss advantages and disadvantages tomorrow in the TS3 server chat. When we do I will remind everyone to, very strictly, NOT be biased about their decision. Together we will work a new system that's far less chaotic then our current system. I look forward to the chat tomorrow, until then I'm very tired and need to sleep.
DrDrRoblox
#172261575Monday, August 24, 2015 1:50 PM GMT

Alright, first off Id like to say Iv have immense experience with being a High Ranking Official for quite the few clans, so I know what works and what doesn't. During this forum I will be explaining to the best of my ability's why we should change the current way trainings and promotions take place. Lets start with trainings. As you all should know by now, trainings happen well over six or seven times per day. That's ridiculous, even by an active clan like TRA's standards. At the very most, trainings should be limited to three times per day. Once in the afternoon around 3PM EST, Another around 6PM EST and the final one around 9PM EST. Having a training during the afternoon takes into account school and possible jobs most users have. How trainings should work, TL;DR version: - Three [Official] trainings per day, all in the afternoon starting at 3PM, then 6PM, and finally at 9PM. Now lets move over to the promotion system. In only two days Iv already achieved the rank of Staff Sergent, although I have a very advanced strategic mind and defensive skills, I find it ridiculous. It should have taken me a week at the very least. Every training I went to I was either promoted or recommened because I was far superior then everyone (Although the Elites provided a good struggle) How the promotion system should properly work, is like the following: - There should be a point system, for each rank a user must gain a set amount of points, the user can also only gain a maximum of 3 points per day, and 1 point per training. - Once a player gets to staff sergeant, they should be able to apply for a higher rank, an appointed HR would review that application and then test that person for said skills. This would reduce the ineffective HR's, so we wouldn't have to reform nearly as often. Alright, with all that being said, id like impute and thoughts on this subject. I already have support from a few HR's, whom, to protect identities I will not be naming at their digression. ----------------------------- My original post, which hopefully wasn't too different, was lost since I went back a page accidently and once I went forward, the response I had made was no longer there. So, I am attempting to rewrite it. First of all, limiting trainings is something I could never agree to. The more trainings there are, the more chance there is for a member of TRA to attend it, and it would not be right to just limit the potential or chance for a member to attend a training. As well, the Officers who host the trainings will always be appreciated for taking time out of their day to help bring activity to the main group, allow connectivity between members of all ranks within the game and hopefully will improve the skills and co-ordination of members through experience in fighting within the training, raid or practice raid. Limiting trainings would not only create potential activity problems for officers who do want to hold a training that day yet cannot hold it because the slots would already be taken by other Officers. Limiting trainings also does not take account of timezones, as I don't want to personally wait until 8pm my time (3 EST for americans on the east coast) for a training to be held. I would rather be able to have the freedom, as any other trainer should, to hold a training at any official TRA training place - so allowing the freedom of choice with places - and at any time I like - also allowing the freedom of time with the trainings itself. I don't see much point for limiting the amount of rewards one can get a day, whether it be a promotion or a point. If that individual has gone to numerous events in their day, and taken the time out of their day as a Low Rank (LR) to attend an event and to either excel or atleast try in that event. If they got some promotions earlier in the day, then they should be able to get more if they are willing to put effort into more events. "In only two days Iv already achieved the rank of Staff Sergent, although I have a very advanced strategic mind and defensive skills, I find it ridiculous. It should have taken me a week at the very least. Every training I went to I was either promoted or recommened because I was far superior then everyone (Although the Elites provided a good struggle)" ----You claim that you were able to do it in 2 days, yet you also claim how good a strategist you are and your skill above others. So you are not the normal or average lower rank, if your claims meet the truth, so obviously it would be quite a fast chain of promotions since you are "far superior then (it's than) everyone'. Just because you got it quickly, does not mean the whol system is too easy for everyone and too quick for every. When I was a low rank, I was not quite so fortunate as yourself, and it took me a lot longer than 2 days to get promotions despite the system being very similar, if not easier to get promotions. Therefore, I would disagree with a point system and the limitation of trainings per day because of the points above. I would also add that in the autumn and winter months, TRA's activity often will dip due to members' personal work or schooling commitments, especially when it is a new school year for students across most of the world, especially the English-speaking nations. The community shouldn't be limited at this time, to encourage involvement and activity. In my own opinion, one should not be able to request a rank themselves, but rather allow the more experienced members of the community in TRA to realise and then decide when a Staff Sergeant is ready for Captain. Such experienced members could be considered as Officers or High Ranks in TRA. I would trust them with the judgement of a lower rank, rather that lower rank's judgement on themselves. " This would reduce the ineffective HR's, so we wouldn't have to reform nearly as often." -- I do feel this is offensive to any High Rank, because their efforts and contributions to the group will always be valued and appreciated. We have only ever had one HR reform, the first of it's kind and magnitude last week and hopefully it is the first and last one we will ever need to perform. HRs are not ineffective, but most will have their own sizeable commitments in life itself. I would not expect them to value a game over their lives, and while they would be a High Rank, their services would always be welcomed at that rank - to be fair, services are welcomed at any and all ranks. "I already have support from a few HR's, whom, to protect identities I will not be naming at their digression. " --- This subject isn't exactly secret and I wouldn't understand at all why the need to not even mention the names of HRs who would support this. The statement you make here, means nothing for such apparent support because of the severe lack of detail, when providing such detail isn't going to harm them in any way, shape or form. I am not very keen on the use of self-complimenting language here, it leans on arrogance and boasting which I am not keen on either. Your own credentials or skill sets, certainly on a public forum thread for such an internal issue in TRA (which I am not keen on either, yet I might as well reply to it as it refers to the group I am part of), shouldn't need to be used in the argument to either solidify your ideas or claims. I personally don't think you know TRA well enough at this stage, unlike many of our Officers or older low ranks, to make such clear judgements on the capability of our High Ranks that take so much time out of their day, or week or years to work with the rest of the group. I also don't think it's very respectable to address your supposed superiority over other people who attend trainings, some may not be as 'skilled' on a computer game as you are. What is ridiculous is the need to limit ambition, limit activity and limit potential. It is not ridiculous that 'an active clan like TRA's standards' holds 6 trainings a day, since it's something that the Officers want to hold and other members want to attend. I shall always value the efforts made and time dedicated to TRA by all members, regardless of rank or capability to perform. While I am Commander, such limitations on people's ambitions - such as a low rank wanting to improve through experience or an Officer willing, if not wanting, to hold a training for the rest of the group - would be non-existant and it'd be up to the next guy to decide whether they wish to do that to the rest of the group. Next time, don't post such internal stuff on a public forum thread, thanks.
superhero93
#172262218Monday, August 24, 2015 2:05 PM GMT

Back in 2012 when I first joined I was far better then I am now because I had more time being on roblox. Now look at me I am worse then before but still I am a staff sergeant as well. I don't think you should limit training because people can be far more active like I was back then. In just a few days I was already a Lance Corporal. IF you were to limit trainings then people well probably lose their strengths and become weaker. We don't want that. Another thing is that if we were to have a point system things would be a lot different. Back then when we had lieutenants there were recommendations on rather you could become a lieutenant or not. We needed 4 HR recommendations to become a lieutenant. This way we could actually test their leadership as well. The way you have it is that you just use skills. Skills isn't everything. If you have good skills but bad tactics you can lose too. Tactics matter as well. So this is why I disagree. -Staff Sergeant Superhero93
Aledriv
#172262224Monday, August 24, 2015 2:05 PM GMT

You make very solid claims, I wont deny that. The reason I wont post what HR's support my ideas, is because, after hanging in TS3 for a bit, it would seem that many people actually hate them and often call that HR names behind their backs. I'm also sorry for being arrogant. But Iv been playing Roblox for just far to long I guess? All my accomplishments just bring me down and make me a lower being sometimes. I'm sorry for that. However, instead of having so many trainings where, to be honest, we don't actually do any team building, we should be doing practice raids instead. If not that, something that will help with team building. ALTHOUGH, I have seen a few players banding together when the time comes, but its just to few. I am in no position to tell you how this clan should work. This is quite simply, a topic for debate that I wrote last night on a red bull and coffee mix. I only decided to write what I did (Albeit sloppily...) after overhearing multiple times, from different users.
narits
#172262432Monday, August 24, 2015 2:09 PM GMT

You're acting like it's bad to train. Although training may not be as effective as raids, PR's or defenses due to our high amount of Captains and Majors it is more effective as we can host them more often due to them being easy to host. On another note, you're saying that it's bad to have 18-25 people at training's? Nonsense. You're not you when you're hungry, grab a VakDonalds.
Aledriv
#172262612Monday, August 24, 2015 2:13 PM GMT

Its not really all that bad to have high amounts of people at trainings. It just makes it incredibly laggy because the hosts have bad internet. If the trainings where split, say 15 people to a lobby, with each lobby having 2 HR's it would be effectively less laggy. And easier to train with. Instead of jumping behind a wall, then getting killed five seconds later from a lag shot. Or worrying about lag reach when sparing with a partner.
TAC69
#172263155Monday, August 24, 2015 2:23 PM GMT

I'm afraid I would have to disagree with you on this issue. Having only 3 trainings a day would put a severe limit on LRs, officers and HRs alike. It limits creativity amongst the officers, because if one would have to reserve a time for a joint training and only use those 3 times while setting a training up with our allies. This leads to an ineffective system and could limit our joint potential with our great allies. This also cause a problem accommodating others in different timezones, even PST. If we have these times, members in Europe and other parts of the world would have little to no chance due to GMT being 5 hours+ EST (That's just for the UK too.) If it is the school year, then no one will stay up that late to get promoted, therefore limiting our wonderfully diverse member base. Secondly, you have stated and others have pointed out that you are "above average" for a trainee. Surely we would want someone "Above average" as a higher rank (SGT, SSGT) and that is why you got promoted quickly. When I have a LR back in 2013, we have an almost identical system to what we have now, the differences being the LT rank and the MPs. The LT rank only effected LR- officer promotions and the MPs existed in the officers. It took me about 2 months to get SSGT. I have seen many people getting promoted at a respectable rate. You also have to consider that we are a superclan, we have hundreds of members on each day trying to earn that next rank, this current system allows everyone to have a fair chance of being promoted from whatever timezone you are from. Lastly, I would like to point out that LRs are not applying for a HR position, HRs being anyone having the rank of Colonel+. LRs are promoted to Captain; an officer rank or more commonly know in the clan world as a MR. We have had application based systems in the past that did not work to its fully potential or just didn't work out the way we completely wanted it. We are open to new ideas yes, but we have already tried this idea and it didn't work out. For example in 2013, it was easy to get LT(officer) because you just needed 4 recs to become an officer. This lead to under qualifying officers at the time. Our current system allows a speedy, efficiency and a quality controlled way to get LRs that meet the standards of officer to an officer rank(that being captain)

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