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𝐒𝐨 𝐥𝐞𝐭'𝐬 𝐭𝐚𝐥𝐤 𝐫𝐞𝐟𝐮𝐧𝐝𝐬
No, let's not, and I'll explain why, quickly and efficiently.
A gamepass by definition is an addition to a game that you may purchase for robux, the premium cu A gamepass is similar to a ### item for the xbox, playstayion, pc, etc. It's an add-on to the game.d-on to the game. You are paying for additional content that isn't included normally for most players. By buying the gamepass, you are paying to use the gamepass. Therefore, you are paying for time. You are paying for the opportunity to spend time using the gamepass.
TJO does not remove your gamepasses, will not remove your gamepasses, and *cannot* remove your gamepasses. If they did so without refunding your robux, that would be fraud, and a reason for TJO to be terminated as a group. However, if you violate Roblox policy, by hacking, exploiting, scamming, or doing other malicious behavior that isn't permitted on Roblox, you forfeit your right to use your gamepass.
So if I play and use the gamepass and then get bored and want to quit, can I get a refund? No, because you got your money's worth.
Example: Say you buy a Computer. You cannot (morally), use the computer for two months, enjoy the benefits of owning it, then return it saying "it doesn't work" or "you didn't really use it".
Call this policy a "no-returns" policy. The gamepasses and Coruscant's description say "No refunds". The only event in which you are entitled to a refund is if your gamepass does not function as described (if it's broken). That definition in itself is vague. TJO's group owner is the only person who can handle refunds. The group owner is not heartless, the group owner understands that there are special circumstances.
"I accidentally bought the Dual Saber gamepass thinking it was the Doubles Saber gamepass". The group owner will work with you, but you cannot simply demand a refund because "you're done playing" or because "it isn't as cool as you thought it was".
I'm leaving this forum open for comments (which is entirely likely a terrible idea).
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This is a great post, it is very well thought out, and very logical. I agree with you fully on the idea of Dual double bladed and the force gamepass and how they are over powered. I also like how you used logic and how you did acknowledge that no, you cannot delete or refund an entire gamepass, would it be possible to nerf the force or put one of the gamepasses off sale? I also agree with how it is strange that the force push can harm you team but, however I do like force push when used against your enemy. I also think that force mend is a decent gamepass, being relatively cheap but, I do see how it can unbalance the odds. The part I totally agree with is the refunds policy, which makes sense, as said in your computer example. All in all thanks Soley on the interesting discussion, I found it very interesting.
-BookMaster77 |
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A thousand thumbs up. Great explanation!~ |
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Thats what I was like... read it and my jaw hit the floor, I did not know someone could write such a good post. |
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Good Job Solely you stated the problem that need to be addressed, I back this fully 100% |
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I agree with DarkeningClaws |
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Its nice to see so many people including a Grand Master choosing to help in this situation. I am intrigued to see how this will play out. |
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### #### said, however, you failed to give any response into the gamepasses overpowered nature. You essentially said "No we won't stop selling these overpowered gamepasses because that's fraud" without saying anything about nerfing them or just stop selling the gamepasses, which isn't fraud as you are allowing those who bought the gamepass to keep it and are preventing everybody else from buying it. You could instead do what a number of other groups do, such as selling blasters (I'm sure theres a way to code the blaster bolts to be blocked when blocking with a lightsaber) or alternatively sell one of the rarer sabers such as the Lightsaber ##### which nobody has heard of and you'd probably look cool with one. Or you could limit the number of colours allowed for sabers, eg: Blue, Red, Green, Yellow then sell the rest of the colours as an 'expansion'. |
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Lee_AskavJoin Date: 2012-05-12
Post Count: 14 |
Sole you said to comment her so I will. But if the GPs are not transferred to the new temple that will anger a lot of people, including me. I own all gamepasses with custom darksaber, custom single and custom DDBs. This would not go down well.... |
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I'm going to argue with this refunds policy.
Game pass
Let me make my point about game ###### every game pass(That your group has made) clearly says that its possible to get a refund; I'm presuming that you thinking "but it doesn't say you will get #### #### it doesn't say you won't get one either. People read the description, before they went and made the decision to buy it, since it said it's possible to have a refund people relaxed a bit thinking if they didn't like the game pass they would get a refund, I like the example you used about the computer but some people like me had wanted a refund after they tested it. You basically scammed us of are robux and lied to us. you decided it was clever to wait for people to ask for refunds then establish a new rule right after well guess what we asked BEFORE! And before you think "how is it a scam" and comment something stupid think what if you were the one in my position
Thank you
PS the thank you is if you read it and actually listened |
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radux32Join Date: 2016-06-15
Post Count: 3 |
Master Solely, i respect and apreciate you but, about gamepasses. I think at TJO must give just one gamepass to an ADV jedi who have no robux. Just one like the force push or dark saber who have a "low cost". To become an Adept, we need very much work and abilities. Seeing a FS/Youngling having OP gamepasses and unrespecting/ignoring a highter rank just because he don't have gamepasses, is just unacteptible. An ADV have to prove good abilityes, non-coruption, modesty and peace. That's why i think as ADV+ whitout robux may win a gamepass. If you think that is right, show this argument to Master Dorandir, it will be a real plesure for me and the persons in this situation (i am not an adept+ yet, so this is not coruption). Don't take it bad, it's just an idea, we should vote if we are for or against it. Thank you for reading! |
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It's actually a very similar response. Because players are purchasing (take the DDBs for example) "This is insanely over powered, deals 70-80 damage per strike...." gamepass. Changing the gamepass *after* they buy it is a scam. They paid for an insanely overpowered item. Nerfing the damage from 70-80 to 40-50 is turning it from insanely overpowered to just simply strong. They paid for a specific product and changing it is denying them the product that they paid for. If we did that, we'd be guilty of false-advertising and they'd be entitled to either take us to Roblox staff for fraud or to demand a refund as blackmail as an alternative to reporting us. We already nerfed the DDBs once. They used to do 160 damage PER BLADE. We turned it from a "get grazed-one hit kill" to a "full contact, 1-2 hit kill". You used to be able to kill people by accidentally grazing them. We had the DDBs on Ilum and simply walking into the blades killed you. If we nerfed them anymore we'd have to refund them.
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^That was in response to NightFuury001
V This is in response to Lee_Askav
It wouldn't be like nothing would transfer over. We'd allow you to keep a custom if it's a single, double, or dual custom. Otherwise we'd be making new GPs to replace the DDBs and such and allow anyone who owned the DDBs or DDB customs to have a new GP that's worth just as much (either loads of content or awesome content/privileges) as a replacement for the overpowered weapons in the new Temple.
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V This is in response to messi2525
I read your post and listened to it, however you basically gave a flawed argument. You pointed out your opinion, denounced mine and then tried to prevent me from replying back to it. By saying:
"And before you think "how is it a scam" and comment something stupid think what if you were the one in my position
Thank you
PS the thank you is if you read it and actually listened"
You basically just said, "I'm right and if you agree, thank you. Otherwise you're wrong".
And I have to disagree, whether you appreciate it or not.
The no refund rule was added months ago. It was added back in February (the third month of TJO's history and first month of real growth). February was back when TJO was still around 20,000 members. The DDBs had either not been made yet, or had just come out. People hadn't really ever asked for a refund before. If there were cases of it, it was fewer than a handful. When we started releasing the custom saber and DDBs, people started demanding refunds en masse. The biggest reason is because people wanted to "get their money back to buy the DDBs". That's not a valid excuse. Originally, gamepasses said *nothing* about refunds at all. We added the clause because people were abusing the system. Originally and still to this day, TJO does refunds for those whose gamepass *does not function*. That is the primary reason for a refund. If the GP does not work or is not as described (if we nerfed it as I explained in my response to NightFuury001) then people can get refunds.
And I can tell you that very few groups/games on Roblox allow you to test a gp and then demand a refund. You watch others use it, and decide if you want it. We don't have the time to deal with every person's indecision on whether they want something or not. You either buy it or you don't. It's called a decision, and the consequences of that decision is solely your responsibility. That's called life. You gotta own up to your actions.
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V This is in response to radux32
I responded to your post already on the first page.
Check back there:
https://forum.roblox.com/Forum/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=215839258
also, Divine <3
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In response to Solely's response to mine.
You never answered my response. I didn't say anything about nerfing the dual double blades. I said to stop selling them but let those who bought it KEEP theirs and simply prevent everybody from having a gamepass. Companies do it all the time. You're just discontinuing that gamepass, it isn't fraud.
I get the feeling you're dodging all the good suggestions and continuously saying the same message of 'We can't refund, we can't do anything' when you actually can. I feel you want to keep these gamepasses so you get a huge flow of Robux without meeting the wants of the people in this group whom you shouldn't see as customers with money but a community working together to have fun. |
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Lee_AskavJoin Date: 2012-05-12
Post Count: 14 |
#### sole, I have one of the very few Custom DDBs aswell as every other gamepass (other than reg DDBs) how would I get compensated for such a huge loss... If I lost multiple GPs there is only one thing I would think about requesting and that is something like having a custom that is the unique dark blade from lore. That would be my only request to be compensated and I'd want this so I would be the only one with it like in the Star Wars universe. |
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Yes this is a great post, I think if the DB can't be removed, you should just lower the damage it does a lot. |
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^In response once again to NightFuury001
I apologize for misreading your suggestion, and indeed, discontinuing the gamepass would help, however at this moment, over 300 people own the gamepass. Therefore, discontinuing it wouldn't be very effective. The game was permanently thrown off-balance the first day the gamepass was sold. Over 50 of the passes were sold in the first 24 hours of its release, the majority to TJO members. TJO's Temple at Coruscant is already a heavily criticized map for being unfair during raids, those 50 OP sabers just put a one ton block of lead on the balance scale in favor of TJO. It was broken long ago and removing the GP from the shop has such an insignificant effect that it'd be more counterproductive to remove it now. I mentioned having GPs not carry over to the new map, which is the best solution to the Dual Double Sabers. It would prevent all members from using the gamepass, essentially restoring equilibrium to the game.
A note: TJO does indeed do refunds. There are regular refunds that happen every couple of days, it just doesn't happen often because the majority of refund requests are: "I want my money back to go spend on front-page game gps, give it.", which we simply can't agree to.
Secondly, you're jumping to conclusions prematurely.
I've been retired since the beginning of March. That means I haven't had an active or useful role in TJO's community in over two months. I don't profit from TJO, and even as Grandmaster I rarely received any payment. If you were to dig through the audit logs, you'd find that I was compensated a number of times for copious labor tasks such as re-ranking over 800 people due to a mass-AA attack. It was a small payment of thanks for my work. However, I'm tangenting. Point about your claim is that TJO is a business, first and foremost. All groups are. If you're going to stay functioning, your group needs to make positive revenue. Side note, none of the HRs get paid. The only person who profits from TJO's revenue is Dorandir, and he ends up putting most of the money back into TJO for further growth anyways. Devs get paid because they're given jobs. Just like any other free-lance job that a group on Roblox would give. Back to the point, being blatantly honest, it is about money. TJO needs money to operate. I'll admit that the relentless pursuit of profit has given the group a questionable reputation in the SW genre, but that's just how it is. Ultimately, decisions are the group owner's, not retired members like myself.
Now the reason your accusation is a premature conclusion is because I don't profit from TJO. I don't participate much in its community and I don't add to it's future. I'm almost essentially a raider, as all I do is banter these days. I do care about the group's reputation, which has gotten me at odds with many TJO HRs, as they feel the reputation is set in stone and can never be amended. It is well known that TJO has a negative reputation for being to ambitious in growth and profit. However, I wouldn't have started this forum if I didn't want to hear other opinions and take steps towards working with the community.
In response to Lee_Askav,
You would be refunded in that case, TJO indeed does refunds, it just requires sufficient reasoning for it. If you were not compensated properly for your loss of gamepasses in the theoretical new temple, then you would be entitled to a refund.
In response to master1477396
You must have missed my earlier posts, dramatically nerfing the gamepass, essentially makes it an entirely different item. It's marketed as "extremely overpowered", you make it like any other saber and then that's false advertising.
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