jacob726Join Date: 2008-07-24
Post Count: 10732 |
I'll just support this without going into too much detail.
But, at times, iron-fist ruling is necessary to "keep the peace." When the community needing to be controlled is a seemingly-mostly-ignorant mass like with ROBLOX, then it is one of those times.
Also, allow me to attempt to find some common ground over the point of voicing out against updates here, will ya?
Voicing out against the updates doesn't violate the WNTS.
I mean, look at outlines.
They had voices against them, and were thus made optional.
Why? Because some people asked for it to be optional, instead of everyone just shouting "REMOVE IT! NOW!". (Forgive the moderately improper punctuation of including my period outside of the quote, but, as the quoted section itself just doesn't have the same emphasis without capitalizing it and giving it's own punctuation, and the English language seeming to have nothing that remedies my concern for it, so... yeah.)
At any rate, the people simply shouting "REMOVE IT! NOW!" were in violation of the WNTS, while those asking for it to be made optional (Which it eventually was) were not in violation of the WNTS.
Personally, I feel that helps to show a decisive difference between what is and what isn't WNTS in regards to opposing an update/idea.
Personal opinion, though: Some complete opposition to an update should be possible so long as the argument is valid and the foundation solid. Is it? Dunno, but I think it should. (As in, I wish it was if it isn't)
More or less, I mean if one can provide a good argument that has more than just a core of "Remove it because it fails," and back it up with good, legitimate examples and all of the like, then they should not be held in violation of the WNTS.
I know it, you know it, some updates are just unwanted, unnecessary, and seem to not be as well thought-out as they could have been. I don't think users should be held in contempt for speaking out against some decisions. Granted, the community is currently over the top with it, what with making 30 to 50 posts about one specific subject and all asking for the same thing, but you need to look at it in another light, too. Some of these users speaking out have paid, and their money is being used directly for the company to function normally. This will sound rude, but it is relatively true; NBC are mostly fodder. They can be compared to pocket change; you can add it up for a sometimes hefty sum, but it's occasionally more trouble than it's worth. On the other hand, BC can be comparable to bills.Sometimes worth about the same as the pocket change, but easier to handle, and transferable to bulk amounts. (Like combining 10 $1 bills into a single $10 bill.) How I even got on this rant, I don't even know any more... this is in a completely different direction than the point I was trying to make... comparing people to money.
Bleh. Anyways, BCers (And indirectly NBCers) have trusted money to the ROBLOX corporation; it is somewhat of a "Job" of the company to keep the game enjoyable for those users. This not only quites the users trying to start a riot over something like outlines (Overexaggeration intended.), but also helps to ensure that users will return for successive memberships.
Think about it, if you signed up for a monthly service for a company(Lets say it's a cleaning company or something.), and when you file a complaint (Say the maid... I dunno... flipped a switch, turning off your TV causing you to miss a recording, or turned off the computer causing you to lose a file transfer.) and the company doesn't do much of anything about it or even give you any word that something is being done about it; then you don't really want to go to that same company, but instead look for a company that does something similar, but with a better reputation.
To get to the "Meat" of that post...
BCers and NBCers entrust money to ROBLOX corporation in the forum of RoBux and BC purchases, and hope that the company will use the funds to make their game more enjoyable. If the experience doesn't improve, or maybe even becomes worse, when another company doing something similar to what the player is looking for comes along, they hop on over to it. - Why do you think the MC boom was here?
People played ROBLOX to build with blocks, they weren't satisfied with the way ROBLOX was ran, so they ran over to MC, who is similar to the Survival #0# series from back a few years. I'd say at least half of the players who jumped from ROBLOX to MC at least played one of the S-#0# series or a similar game before hopping over due to various things... The lack of single-player in ROBLOX for games where "Griefers" as the term has come to be called, run amok with very little able to be done about them; for example.
For MC, to not risk griefers, you simply don't play online. For ROBLOX? You almost completely avoid the game in question, and often have to server-hop and start completely anew in another server to escape it.
Anyone else see the problem there?
... I don't even remember what my original point was any more... ... I dunno, consider most of that venting, it mostly is... but I'm too... er... lazy, to delete all of that and retype something of equal length.
~>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CQ0I7S19jw<~ |
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OTDIALGAJoin Date: 2013-06-27
Post Count: 1434 |
You do relize People who say stuff against WNTS are just trolls,or are just kidding right? |
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EspithelJoin Date: 2009-10-09
Post Count: 20917 |
I might find some entertainment here. Shame I had to log off a few minutes after I found this bumped. :/
"a good chunk of the WNTS are arbitary (i.e dont suggest to remove huge updates even though they may be terrible)"
Deal with it.
Actually, you do know it's your fault, yes?
Well, not YOUR fault, but rather the fault of the community?
I'm pretty sure I saw an outline thread in 2012. Was popular as well.
And paid access places threads are definitely there, hands down. If you've been on S&I 2012 and 2011 you've seen one of them.
So, blame US for the bad updates, because WE suggested them.
Hm.
The irony.
@buzzshockey
"No support, why? So you want to punish someone that is new to the forums, do you really think people read those rules and WNTS when they first post on the forums?"
Force them to.
There.
Happy?
IE: Redirect them onto the WNTS.
Postscript: The punishment is the removal of the thread and invalidation. Which hardly counts as a ban at all. It merely states "stop wasting your time," and that's what it's all about.
"Also why do you care?"
Is that a rhetorical question?
I don't know, sounds like it but it doesn't.
In case it isn't, I care so roblox can actually listen to us.
Something the WNTS helps with.
Something the violation of the WNTS does not.
"and do you really think this will make people listen?"
It's not designed to.
It's designed to show people that they're wasting thier time.
And it'll work.
If it's worked in the past, it'll work now.
People were abundantly ignorant in 2010 and 2011, the only difference now is the quantity of ignorant people.
And before you go on about how outlines are going to be optional apparantly:
Notice how the major petitions about them were to make them optional, not to remove them entirely.
I dislike it, but that wasn't a violation. That was (unfortunately :/) going foward to some extent, which I can back up on that part.
It's the fact that the fowarding was optionality that I dislike, because toggles and stuff like that is basically "I don't want this, I'll leave it for other people to fix."
"Look at the punishments ROBLOX give out for people breaking the normal rules and look they still break the rules."
Mweh.
They'll break the rules, maybe.
They won't get thier thread cared about, though.
The WNTS is final.
It will always be final.
@Zersdan:
"You BC Jim Crow."
A) Explain how me being a BCer creates a valid argument against me. It doesn't- I was feverent of the WNTS in 2010 and 2011, I feverent asked for it back (Hm. The irony.) and I wasn't a BCer until July 2011. So really. Not valid.
It's basically like saying black people are stupid (just an example guys, just an example) when:
A) It's just a skin colour (And like wise, just a set of benefits.)
B) There's no statistical evidence for such a claim (And likewise for BCers being ignorant.)
B) Is that the only argument you can create against me? You really need to learn how to fully critisise a post instead of just succinctly putting it into a single sentence.
@Lego:
The punishment I had in mind is the deletion of any thread that violates the WNTS.
Hardly deadly. |
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNEy_y75xYI |
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As I am looking at the s&l I find this forum about the wnts.your jokeing right? We do not have a voice on roblox anymore and you just post this??? Some of us can not play roblox anymore because of errors.
No support. |
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EspithelJoin Date: 2009-10-09
Post Count: 20917 |
@Punks:
Ever thought _*WHY*_ we don't have a voice anymore?
Because we ignore the rules. We don't care about roblox's life, attempts to make us happy, or anything like that, it seems.
We've proven ourselves not worth listening to. We've proven ourselves to be imbeciles.
Why listen to imbeciles?
If this rule is created, we can enjoy a voice again.
And, you can't play because of errors?
What has that got to do with the WNTS?
Nothing.
It's not against the WNTS to post fixes to errors, or have people forgot that going backward is never the solution?
It's also not against the WNTS to go into technical issues and post your problem there. ¬_¬
*Sigh*
I'm still awaiting a valid argument against this, really.
One from logic, not emotion. |
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@frozengaia
Partial support.
While I'm all for threads that contradict the WNTS being redacted/eaten, a ban seems like an unreasonable step-up. Maybe remove the user's ability to make new threads instead?
-Virtualdarks |
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EspithelJoin Date: 2009-10-09
Post Count: 20917 |
I'm kinda wondering why people assume I mean banning them and nothing else, Virtual.
"Personally, I think that any thread that contradicts the WNTS should get content deleted or even eated (removed.), and threads on S&I should be reportable for such an action (Under "other", typing in WNTS violation is what I mean) Sassle, a person I mentioned earlier in the thread, says to ban anyone who violates the WNTS. Kinda harsh, but still."
Hmmm :/.
The fact I said it was Sassle's idea to ban people, not mine, and mine was to simply delete the WNTS violations...
Maybe I just type too pedantically.
Well, removing thier ability to post for consequtive violations could be a decent idea, I guess.
Thanks for adding a third option.
:D |
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nairbJoin Date: 2007-12-14
Post Count: 12396 |
Sure, support. |
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nairbJoin Date: 2007-12-14
Post Count: 12396 |
Addon:
Can this also work for the following?
"Rudeness is not allowed. Examples of what not to post as your only reply, “Get out”, “dumb idea”, “no support”, “no, just no”. Short negative replies are not at all helpful and diminish the effort the person put into posting their idea."
I made a thread pointing out other rude examples here: http://www.roblox.com/Forum/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=110145523 |
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02AlienJoin Date: 2010-05-28
Post Count: 1869 |
support |
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ZersdanJoin Date: 2012-06-30
Post Count: 863 |
This is a bad idea. |
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EspithelJoin Date: 2009-10-09
Post Count: 20917 |
My thank you mr. Nairb and mr. alien.
And Zersdan, I'm just going to ignore you now.
You're not even worth dealing with. |
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Nigel217Join Date: 2011-04-09
Post Count: 570 |
I could support this, if only Roblox let's us have any feedback on some of the updates, for example; Font Change and so on. We need to give feedback. BUT the petitions and all kinds of massive overcreating of forums with the same titles won't help. If Roblox asks us about updates we shall answer, else many shall do it the way they do. No matter what the punishments, most of those people live on breaking the rules. |
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ZersdanJoin Date: 2012-06-30
Post Count: 863 |
@frozen
Just like you on my other post. |
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EspithelJoin Date: 2009-10-09
Post Count: 20917 |
Not really zersdan, or else you wouldn't have had a conversation with me for 3 pages. :D
Thanks for the bump.
And Nigel, I've love to allow people to have feedback on an idea before it comes out, I really would.
But until they can be trusted to have a say, that'll have to wait.
Bwamp. |
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Get 5 warnings, and then day/2 day ban? It'd stop trolls. |
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ZersdanJoin Date: 2012-06-30
Post Count: 863 |
@frozen
I ran you out of my forum.
Your opinion is no longer valid, or one I should take into consideration.
Also, the idea is bad because what if more things are added to the WNTS? Or what if in the middle of the WNTS post, it becomes reasonable? Or no longer a WNTS post? I'm guessing you will go off the 1st post, like a lazy dumb ****. |
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I don't forum and I haven't forumed on RBX back in 08 when I played either, even till now I don't actively forum. However, this post seemed relevant to dealing with unwanted posts, so I thought I'd take a look at it out of boredom and the sake of productivity.
Content deletion of a post that proves irrelevant or adheres to the list of unwanted material that is ruled in the WNTS is probably the most valid punishment you can get. I'd say every log-in to the forums would force a reading of the WNTS should you have violated it the last time. Unless you have some problem or inept to the point you don't comprehend the WNTS, Sassle's idea of a ban would come into play, HOWEVER, only applying to the FORUMS. A ban on the entire account isn't necessary, as this is the forums and players still would like to play and build games with the gear/hats/BC membership/models they've constructed/built up so far.
Unfortunately I didn't put in too much, but seeing as how much support there is and how much lack of reason and anti-support to gun down this idea is it seemed excessive. All in all, I think this is good and so...
Gimme a hi-five on the hand, palm, back.
Charge up your laser and fly high like an arrow.
Turn your body into hardtack like Nyan Cat.
And float away leaving behind a rainbow.
I SUPPORT. |
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Ninja509Join Date: 2009-06-03
Post Count: 433 |
You realize that there is no reason to punish the kids who can't read, the forum members do it themselves. If someone was to say "LETZ ALL GET FR33 TX, DOUBLE THE MONEY PER DAY!", about 10 forum members would refer to the WNTS. |
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sassle12Join Date: 2009-09-26
Post Count: 2382 |
Support. Besides Frozen the fact you said that you got an idea off me makes me, *sniff* very proud of my underling.
*wink, wink*
Anyhow I will sticky this and bump it constantly. |
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sassle12Join Date: 2009-09-26
Post Count: 2382 |
Oh yes I couldn't read this for a day because I was banned for saying something appropriate with an inappropriate word within, it was obviously not used for that meaning. Honestly though I think the fact the thread is made by you makes the post a lot more... Popular? |
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MettaurSpJoin Date: 2010-03-20
Post Count: 3179 |
@OTD, no one has pointed this out yet, probably because you aren't worth anyone's time, but most threads that people post WNTS on, like 90-95ish percent, are actually WNTS threads. And Zer, just because someone "lost" on one thread definitely does not mean that their opinion is invalid everywhere else. And besides, if a thread is WNTS, it shouldn't have been posted in the first place because it wastes everyone's time, just make some edits so it isn't WNTS and try posting again.
I support, although I find it entertaining looking through WNTS threads, they still take up time and space bumping down good threads, and give the mods bad impressions of us making them less likely to respond. |
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EspithelJoin Date: 2009-10-09
Post Count: 20917 |
@Zersdan:
"I ran you out of my forum."
Actually, I had to log off.
And it's no longer alive or well, so why necrobump?
I don't see it, so there's little to no point bumping it.
Consider this as well Zersdan:
If I had not posted on that thread, you wouldn't have even gotten close to the number of posts you have now. It would have died.
In that respect, I gave that thread life, by attempting to destroy it,
Ironic, no?
By posting on this thread, you're making an idea you dislike more seeable.
So why did I post on a thread?
To attempt to explain.
But what did you do?
You got aggressive, you couldn't take basic simple critisism.
*Sigh*
You're an embodiment of the reason why roblox's community is an ascetic.
But if I must, I'll come back to it with a stronger argument next time I see it in the fourms.
Might actually be fun.
Hm, so much for ignoring you.
Well, perhaps actually talking to you will help you help me bump this post.
Should try that.
Hey zersdan! Keep arguing! I get free bumps!
"Your opinion is no longer valid, or one I should take into consideration."
Hehehehehehehe
Do you want me to come back?
I can more than easily decimate your argument.
But you can't accept it, it seems.
Hm, why am I starting to aggress.
"Also, the idea is bad because what if more things are added to the WNTS?"
Then you don't post those things, derp.
"Or what if in the middle of the WNTS post, it becomes reasonable?"
Not going to happen-
Well, it will happen for oversuggested ideas, but then they get the idea and will probably make it.
"Or no longer a WNTS post?"
Wut.
I'm assuming you mean that something gets removed from the WNTS because you weren't explicit enough to make an undeclared assumption.
Then you can talk about those things. Simple.
"I'm guessing you will go off the 1st post, like a lazy dumb"
Hypocrtite count: six.
Because you completely ignore the bulk of my argument and try to counter me with a single line that I can more than easily counter.
Still awaiting a valid argument against this idea.
@Ninja:
If they can't read,
Why on earth are they on the fourms?
Children shouldn't be allowed to get away for breaking the rules, just like adults.
I treat adults just like children, and vice versa. It makes no difference to me, it's just an age difference for all I care.
Anyway, I completely agree with you there, Keva.
And my thank you for the support mr. Keva and mr. Metta.
Bwamp. |
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